carpenter castle

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Re: carpenter castle

Postby AmazingSleep » Tue Feb 21, 2012 7:36 am

medalliah wrote:
Kaiu Genji wrote:Your personality need not be at the current battlefield to pay for Carpenter Castle's cost.

As Medalliah said, it is not performed anymore, nor does it target, both of which are now written explicitly on cards.

Heck, you can bow that bad siege terrain for the cost of the stronghold should you need to.


Correct that you can bow the Terrain for it, however for a Personality to be legally targeted it must be at the current battlefield, same as Attachments. Holdings/terrains/strongholds/regions do not follow the same rules as Personalities or Attachments when it comes to targeting them, as they can never be at the current battlefield.

Dario


Correct. Remember guys, Rule of Presence and Rule of Location. In particular:

L5R Rules wrote:Rule of Location

The Rule of Location: This rule has two parts:

1) A card in a unit must be at the current battlefield to be targeted by, or explicitly perform, a Battle action.
2) If a Battle action is on a card in a unit (a Personality or attachment in play), the unit must be at the current battlefield in order to take that action.


When you target a siege holding or a siege terrain those are not cards "in a unit" and thus need not be at the current battlefield to be targeted by CC. But once you target a personality, the rule of Location checks to see if the personality is at the current battlefield, since a personality (even by himself) does constitute being "in a unit". If the personality is not at the current battlefield, the ONLY type of action that could target him would be one that would move him to the current battlefield.

For what it's worth, the rules text on CC:

Castle
Siege Battle: Bow your target Castle or Siege card: Ranged 5 Attack. If this targeted a card, gain 2 Honor.


It's the "bow your target castle...." that requires the personality to be at the current battlefield.
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Re: carpenter castle

Postby Kaiu Genji » Tue Feb 21, 2012 9:43 am

Yep, missed that Carpenter Castle did say target. That sucks :(

As for the terrain, it's not like you can really have terrains at any battlefield but the current one :P
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Re: carpenter castle

Postby r0cky143 » Tue Feb 21, 2012 10:42 am

Thanks for clearing that up guys. I was trying to figure out how a terrain could be out but not at the current battlefield.

and if I am reading this right, in any situation you need to have presence at this battle in order to fire off the ability from the castle. I can't just bow fortifications and shoot someone in the face without having someone at the current battlefield.
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Re: carpenter castle

Postby medalliah » Tue Feb 21, 2012 10:59 am

Correct, you need to have someone there to be able to legally take the action.

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Re: carpenter castle

Postby Hida Okami » Tue Feb 21, 2012 11:14 am

I don't believe that is entirely correct. The stronghold itself is a Castle card; therefore it can be bowed to use the ability and obviously does not require Presence in that case.
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Re: carpenter castle

Postby medalliah » Tue Feb 21, 2012 11:25 am

Hida Okami wrote:I don't believe that is entirely correct. The stronghold itself is a Castle card; therefore it can be bowed to use the ability and obviously does not require Presence in that case.


In order to announce a legal battle action at the current battlefield, you must have units at the current battlefield unless the card moves somebody to the current battlefield, or states that it can be used "even if you control no units at the current battlefield" like Heavily Engaged does.

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Re: carpenter castle

Postby barswanian » Tue Feb 21, 2012 11:34 am

medalliah wrote:
Hida Okami wrote:I don't believe that is entirely correct. The stronghold itself is a Castle card; therefore it can be bowed to use the ability and obviously does not require Presence in that case.


In order to announce a legal battle action at the current battlefield, you must have units at the current battlefield unless the card moves somebody to the current battlefield, or states that it can be used "even if you control no units at the current battlefield" like Heavily Engaged does.

Dario


Or now if it creates presence without a restriction like duty of the crab's.
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Re: carpenter castle

Postby medalliah » Tue Feb 21, 2012 11:57 am

barswanian wrote:
medalliah wrote:
Hida Okami wrote:I don't believe that is entirely correct. The stronghold itself is a Castle card; therefore it can be bowed to use the ability and obviously does not require Presence in that case.


In order to announce a legal battle action at the current battlefield, you must have units at the current battlefield unless the card moves somebody to the current battlefield, or states that it can be used "even if you control no units at the current battlefield" like Heavily Engaged does.

Dario


Or now if it creates presence without a restriction like duty of the crab's.


Duty of the Crab states you need to have someone there to take the action. However this is also correct (as of EE)

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Re: carpenter castle

Postby barswanian » Tue Feb 21, 2012 12:37 pm

medalliah wrote:
barswanian wrote:
medalliah wrote:In order to announce a legal battle action at the current battlefield, you must have units at the current battlefield unless the card moves somebody to the current battlefield, or states that it can be used "even if you control no units at the current battlefield" like Heavily Engaged does.

Dario


Or now if it creates presence without a restriction like duty of the crab's.


Duty of the Crab states you need to have someone there to take the action. However this is also correct (as of EE)

Dario


;) which is why I said "without a restriction like it"
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Re: carpenter castle

Postby Hida Okami » Tue Feb 21, 2012 12:39 pm

medalliah wrote:In order to announce a legal battle action at the current battlefield, you must have units at the current battlefield unless the card moves somebody to the current battlefield, or states that it can be used "even if you control no units at the current battlefield" like Heavily Engaged does.

Point taken - but still, one need not bow a personality at the battle if the cost can be fulfilled in another way (such as bowing the Stronghold itself).
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